Baha’i Justice

I asked specific questions which you utterly failed to answer. If Remey was the “infallible” Guardian in all matters pertaining to the faith then why did he make not one, but two, errors in appointing a successor? Didn’t he know the rules? Quinn

Number one, Mason did not authorize the council to take any such action and when he found out that this is what they had done, he told them to “cease and disist”, to not do anything more with the lawsuit, and thus the lawsuit that was instigated by the members of Mason’s sIBC was never persued and it went into default and the Baha’is of Wilmette counter sued and had an injunction placed in 1966.
As far as Mason’s appointments, Mason knew all along that the only candidate for his successor was his son, and if there is only one son left at the Guardian’s passing, the Guardianship passes to them. In the Will & Testament, Abdu’l-Baha never says that the succeeding Guardian has to accept his position, but that he can appoint someone to sit in his place. This is exactly what Pepe did. Pepe wrote letters where he states very emphatically that if the multitude of the Baha’is were to come to him and ask him to be their Guardian, he would do it and ackowledged that the Aghsan lineage continued through him. Pepe then, in the same style and manner that Abdu’l-Baha adopted Mason, Pepe adopted Neal Chase in letters written to him and other beleivers to be his successor. This is the “Mystery of the Kingdom” that is spoken of both in the bible and in the Baha’i Writings. The “Mystery of the Kingdom” the bible explains, is that the “Gentiles will inherit the kingdom” and this would be called the “times of the Gentiles” when the lineage of David would be grafted into by the Gentiles, i.e. a non-physical descendant of David.(Read Romans Chp. 11 as well as Abdu’l-Baha’s last Tablet to America where he mentions this same grafting in of the tree from “another branch”.) Baha’u’llah called Abdu’l-Baha “The Mystery of God” because Abdu’l-Baha chose a gentile to inherit the kingdom by adopting him as his son and appointing him. It is then prophesied in both the bible and the Baha’i writings that another “natural branch” would be grafted back into the tree which is another natural, blood-line descendant of David and collateral descendant through the male line of Baha’u’llah. This is Neal Chase ben Joseph Aghsan who is a Jew who is descended from the male line through the collateral descendants of Baha’u’llah who moved from Tabaristan to Russia. The natural blood-line of Baha’u’llah and the Aghsan lineage has been grafted back once again and thus the “times fo the Gentiles” is over. Read in the bible about what happens after this, it is very, very interesting.
AS far as the “sane” “insane” aspect of people feeling as if they are the ones who can decide of another’s mental capacity, it doesn’t nake any difference. Pepe wrote in a letter that even if the Guardian goes “gaga” that is no reason to abandon him and deny him and even more, try to usurp from him. The Guadianship issue is very simple; two criteria: he has to be a son “Aghsan” and he has to be appointed. Any other criteria that others try to add like he has to be young or old or knowledgeable or handsome or he has to accept it and proclaim his acceptance or anything, is not the identifying criteria. By this simple two-part criteria, the lineage of David has continued unbroken for over three thousand years.
Neal Chase is the only survivng natural branch who was appointed by the previous Guardian and who has compiled the Genealogy of Baha’u’llah as well as written inumerable tablets and epistles enumerating the history of the Baha’i Faith and how this history relates to the history of the ancients and the proofs contained therein as well as his research into the mathematical evidence contained throughout the world and its verying cultures and beliefs and continuous contact with the BUPC throughout the world. To see the first Fireside given by the Guardian Neal Chase Ben Joseph Aghsan and hear some of these explanations by him youself, go here:
www.bahaifireside.org
Victor

Please take 10 minutes to read about the protecting power of the covenant.
Lorenzo

Victor Woods wrote:
But, is the Catholic Church the buildings and the grounds or is it the institution of the Pope and the Catholic Heirarchy? The test for the believers 50 years ago was that the Baha’i Faith cannot exist without a Guardian. The Test that Mason gave was you have to know who is the right candidate for the job.

So if a religion is the institutions then why was the original lawsuit brought by Remey all about trying to grab the Wilmette Temple and control of the voluntary financial donations mainstream believers give? Why have all the historic campaigns by splinter groups or individuals been about power and property and money?
As for Remey – are you saying that he screwed up in appointing Harvey and Marangella? Are you saying the “infallible” guardian didn’t know who was the right candidate for the job? How did Remey come to appoint the “wrong” candidate not once but twice? How can a “guardian” fail in that most basic way? As for his “son” (I take it you mean the adopted Pepe) where does it say in the writings that sons AUTOMATICALLY are appointed? Remey never appointed Pepe to anything and Pepe is on record as saying he would have refused if he had.
By the way – do you agree with Marangella that Remey was sane when he appointed Marangella but conveniently insane when he disbanded the body that Marangella headed and appointed Donald Harvey? Or was Remey just plain old wrong? Why, in your opinion, did Remey appoint Harvey or Marangella? And where is the proclamation from Remy appointing anyone else? Quinn

Again, it wasn’t the Orthodox Baha’is that spurned this whole thing on, but the BUPC. The writer of this aritcle doesn’t mention the BUPC because the Law Firm representing the BUPC pro bono declined to comment at this time.

The analogy of the vatican is funny. But, is the Catholic Church the buildings and the grounds or is it the institution of the Pope and the Catholic Heirarchy? The test for the believers 50 years ago was that the Baha’i Faith cannot exist without a Guardian. The Test that Mason gave was you have to know who is the right candidate for the job. Yes, he appointed several to be his successor, but he only had one son and according to the laws of primogeniture, the successorship goes to the son, the Aghsan, as stated in the Will, not anybody who just decides they are the one. Doesn’t work. The lineage of David through Baha’u’llah is preserved as it has been through the last three thousand years, with not any hiccups. Well….maybe a hiccup or two, but the line is unbroken and adheres to every dot and tittle of the Will & Testament of Abdu’l-Baha.

The truth is easily arrived at if you are willing to accept the truth. The truth is easy to discern, that is, as Jesus says, if you have the eyes to see and the ears to hear and the heart to understand and accept what your intellect is telling you. The will states that the Guardian has to be an Aghsan – a male Heir of Baha’u’llah. Mason was the only Aghsan left that hadn’t broken the Covenant. He was Aghsan as he was adopted by Abdu’l-Baha, but an adopted son has all the rights and priveledges of a natural son, including the laws on inheritence. Joel Marnegella, although a very distinguished and spiritual man, is not an Aghsan. Donald Harvey is not an Aghsan. Only Mason Remey was proclaimed to the whole Baha’i World that he was Abdu’l-Baha’s “Aghsan”. Shoghi Effendi acknowledged this by according to Mason Abdu’l-Baha’s inheitence to him as “Abdu’l-Baha’s ‘Dear Son'”. Shoghi put Mason at the head of that institution of the IBC for the very fact that there were no other Aghsan to fulfill that position. The IBC was the UHJ just in its infant form that was to evolve through a four stage process, the next stage from the IBC being the Baha’i World Court that was the goal for 1963, not that it would become the UHJ in 1963, but that it would become the World Religious Court for the Baha’is in Israel by 1963. Then in 1959 the “Hands” disbanded the IBC Shoghi Effendi set up (going against Shoghi Effendi) and set up another and completely bypassed the World Court stage saying In ‘Baha’i World Vol. XIII, that “due to the secularization of religious courts in this part of the world, the Baha’i world court may not be realized.” Which is total bunk as the Druze set up their religious court in Israel in 1963. The reason the “Hands” didn’t want the Baha’i Court set up in Israel is that it would have had Mason at its head and this would have only cemented his position as Guardian with the Israeli Government, so they did away with it, and this is why Mason had to come out with a proclamation.

For those who have the eyes to see and the ears to hear,
Victor

Goash, what a lazy piece of journalism. Quite how the writer can get the orthodox Baha’is taking the mainstream Bahai’s to court in the 60s the other way round is staggering. It is that original court decision the mainstream group is asking to be adhered to.

Why wait so long – the internet. Quite apart from being big bad bullies, the mainstream group were were happy to leave the 40 or so breakways to themselves until suddenly they started posting pictures of the mainstream groups buildings and appropriated the name of the UHJ. Imagine a group of 300 or so people from around the World breaking away and, with one man declaring himself the “true” Pope, putting up a website with a picture of the Vatican claiming all sorts of weird beliefs as though that building, and the religion itself belonged to this tiny group.

You don’t thnk the Catholic Church might step in?

As for Joel Marangella, he was so infuriated that Mason Remey had appointed someone else as his successor (Donald Harvey) and disbanded the set-up Marangella was head of that he (Marangella) declared Remey to be insane (without prioducing a single shred of medical evidence) and declared himnself “guardian” while Remey was yet still living.

What a shame this journalist put together such a poorly informed and (non) researched piece. Quinn

Here is a good compilation of information on just these type of subjects.

http://bupc.org/test-of-god.html

Victor

There seems to be a great deal of misunderstanding about the court proceedings and rulings in this case. If you want to read for yourself what the NSA attempted to do, you can read the court documents at this link: http://www.truebahai.com/court_case.html

The Court ruled that the OBF and BPUPC were NOT successor organizations to the Remey group and therefore were not bound by the 1966 Order against Remey. Please note this was a ruling based upon corporate law and has nothing to do with the religious authority and succession of one Guardian to another. Jeffrey

I’m surprised to see an article like this in the Chicago Tribune. The author obviously has no idea what the Orthodox “Baha’is” are about.

Also, calling the Baha’i Faith a sect of Islam is like calling Christianity a form of Judaism. Kourosh

Janet wrote:
What Truth might be revealed?
The truth is out there.
Thanks for reading. I’ve already started.

Thanks Janet, I appreciate your viewpoint and I agree. I would love it if we could, one and ALL, come together and, adhereing to Baha’i principals of consultation as enumerated by Shoghi Effendi, come to a unified understanding of the Revelation of Baha’u’llah and then, united in Faith and Sprit, begin to educate and help heal the nations of the world. “The leaves are for the healing of the nations.”
There is a tablet by Baha’u’llah called the Nightingale and the Crow. Teherzadeh talks about it:

“It likens the birds to the Owl[1]who once argued that the song of the Crow was much more melodious than that of the Nightingale. Challenging this statement, the Nightingale demanded some evidence, and invited the Owl to investigate the truth by hearing the melody of each bird, so that the sweet music of the Bird of Heaven might be distinguished from the croaking of the Crow. But the Owl refused and said ‘Once from inside a rose-garden the enchanting voice of a bird reached my ears, and when I enquired its origin, I was informed that the voice was that of the Crow. Simultaneously, a crow flew out of the garden and it became clear to me who the singer was.’
[1 The owl in Persian and Arabic literature is a symbol of doom and ruin.] 242
‘But that was My voice,’ said the Nightingale to the Owl,’and to prove it I can warble similar if not more beautiful melodies now.”I am not interested to hear Thy songs,’ the Owl made reply,’for I saw the Crow and have been assured by others that the melody from inside the garden was his. But those with unsullied hearts and sanctified ears have been able to distinguish the voice of the true Nightingale from that of the Crow.'[1]
The story of the Owl ends here, and the Rose continues its dialogue with the birds disguised as nightingales. It tells them that they too are of the same nature as the Owl, in that they prefer their own vain imaginings to the multitude of proofs and testimonies which have been demonstrated by the rose-like beauty of the Friend. It calls upon them to recognize the Rose by its charm and perfume and not through their own standards. As these exhortations reach their climax, a beautiful nightingale[1] with a melodious voice enters the garden and, enchanted with the beauty of the Rose, begins to circumambulate it.’Although outwardly you look like nightingales,’ it addresses 243 the birds in a tone of rebuke,’as a result of association with the Crow, you have learnt its ways and have acquired its characteristics.’ Pointing to the Rose it then declares:’This divine Rose is the object of the adoration of the nightingales of paradise, and this rose-garden is their abode. It is not a habitation for mortal birds. Take your leave and begone.'[2]”
The way to distinguish the Nightingale from the Crow is that the Nightingale is the one wanting evidence and is the one who invites the others to investigate and compare the voices to see which one is the true Nightingale. But the Owl refuses to investigate and says that it is convinced the Crow sang the beautiful melodies because it has been “assured by others” (in-justice) that it was the Crow.
The Baha’is Under the Provisions of the Covenant want more than anything the opportunity to be able to compare the melodies of all those who claim to be the Nightingale, i.e. the true Baha’i Faith as revealed by Baha’u’llah. We believe the Divine Standard has been unfurled and we invite all to join us under this Divine Standard of God showing how the whole of the world of humanity is one family. These are documented, historical proofs that can be investigated individually.
http://bupc.org/genealogy/genealogy-of-christ…
Victor